UNSILENT: A SPEAK SERIES BY NOSTIGMAS EP. 7 - "Befriending Bipolar: A Quest for Happiness" with guest, Oliver Seligman, a Uk-based author and former Broker, now Monk. He opens up about his life with mental health challenges and coming into a Bipolar Disorder diagnosis.
He is an outspoken advocate about the power of love in this world -- and the healing ability of kindness. Oliver is a wonderful soul committed to showing diagnoses don't define us and how truly magical life can become with a support system, self-compassion, and staying the course with self-care and treatment plans that support your wellness. Be sure to check out Oliver's book "Befriending Bipolar" and learn more about him and his story at www.BefriendingBipolar.co.uk.
Oliver's bio:
"As a meditation teacher with 20 years experience, he is an expert on the workings of the mind and on guiding people to inner peace. Oliver was diagnosed with bipolar type one when he was seventeen and has lived with this illness ever since. Despite the challenges that come with it, he has not only befriended his illness, he has found a state of lasting happiness."
Be sure to tune in right here every Wednesday at 2 PM Eastern for more REAL talk with REAL people. You can also visit nostigmas.org/unsilent to watch, listen to, and read all of our conversations this season. We are survivors, thrivers, advocates, and Allies. We see you. We love you. BE UNSILENT 💚
SPECIAL THANKS TO:
Guest: Oliver Seligman (www.befriendingbiploar.co.uk)
Host: Eli Lawson
MEET THE TEAM
Video Editor: John Panicucci
Producer: Eli Lawson
Marketing: Lance Bordelon & Maggie Seagraves
Founder: Jacob Moore [IG: @jacobmoore]
Web: www.nostigmas.org
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#bipolarawareness #bipolarstrong #bipolardisorderawareness #mentalhealth #mentalhealthawareness #mentalhealthadvocate #mentalhealthsupport #mentalhealthstigma #mentalhealthstories #mentalhealthstoriesmatter #suicideprevention #mentalhealthallies #anxietyawareness #depressionawareness
SHOW NOTES:
Oliver:
Most of us, we are trained to think, “Well, I will love once that person shows me. Once they show me that they love me, then I’ll love them.” But it's actually the other way around. To really love someone, you have to risk not being loved back.
Eli:
This is Unsilent, a Speak series from NoStigmas that champions mental health advocacy, and challenges the stigmas that prevent people from getting the help they need. I'm Eli Lawson, a producer for the show. This week, I'll be having a conversation with Oliver, an author and inspirational speaker. We’ll dive into Oliver’s tumultuous quest for happiness and his incredible transformation from a London stock broker to a peace-teaching monk, all while grappling with bipolar disorder. And we may just find that happiness isn't where you’d normally look. Thank you for being here. If you want to learn more, or contact us visit nostigmas.org Don't face it alone. Be unsilent.
Today's episode contains a couple of examples of bipolar-induced psychosis that actually lead to self harm. While there's nothing graphic, it may be triggering for some, it's okay if you need to skip this one. Do what's right for you.
Eli:
So, Oliver, is that? Is that what you go by? Do you have a preferred name? Or is it just Oliver?
Oliver:
Yeah, Oliver is my legal name, and my monk name is Maitreya. But Oliver is easiest for this.
Eli:
Okay, what's the origin of the monk name? Where does that come from?
Oliver:
Well, I'm an omniscient monk, I have been for the last 18 years, which basically means that I've committed myself to experiencing more peace and happiness, and to helping other people experience that if they want it. And the whole monk part is the fact that I've dedicated my life to that. I think the name change is more about giving me something to aspire to, because the name has meanings that are definitely part of my essence. But maybe particularly when I first became a monk, I didn't have a lot of contact with those things. So it's a way of strengthening my good qualities, I would say.
Eli:
Like a reminder almost, it sounds like
Oliver:
Yeah, that's exactly right. After I'd been a monk for about 10 years, decided to write a book on part of my journey towards finding peace, because I thought I had quite an exciting story. Because when I was 23, I got a job at Morgan Stanley, and then Merrill Lynch in London, and then in New York, and I worked as a sales trader there for almost three years. But it was one of these typical stories where I was working to try and make as much money is I could, so that at some point, I could then buy a place on the beach in Thailand, and retire happy. That was my gear.
Eli:
That sounds like a great goal to me.
Oliver:
Yes, it sounds great. It did. Well, the problem was, it very rarely works. Because, even though I started to make good money, and I started to save up for that place on the beach, I became less and less happy myself. Because I wasn't following my heart. I wasn't following what I really wanted to do with my life, and instead, I was trying to logically fit a career into my life so that I could then do something in the future. But what I discovered many years later, was that happiness and peace exist right now. The idea that we can arrange our life in a certain way, so that we'll be happy in the future, is actually a myth.
Eli:
Sounds like it wasn't worth it.
Oliver:
No, it wasn't. So I left and I felt really good for about six weeks, because all my stress kind of left me. But then I started to notice that I was having the same feelings and the same negative thoughts. Even though I had plenty of money, I was living in a nice place with a good friend of mine, had a great family, was in good health at the time. And I panicked. I really panicked because all I really wanted was to be happy. And I tried this one way I thought would work and it hadn't, and I didn't know what to do. And then there was quite a funny story because I traveled up to Scotland, and I was being given a shiatsu massage by this guy to try to de-stress me, and it was a really good massage. But this guy kept talking about this thing called ascension, and how happy he'd become with it and how it had really helped him in his relationships and in his daily life and whatever. And me being a pretty stubborn, cynical trader, I’m just sitting there thinking, dude just shut up and give me the massage. I don't want to hear about peace, I just want to get a massage. So anyway, at the end of the massage, he said to me, you should look it up, you know, you should look up this meditation. And I said, yeah, no problem, and in my head thinking, no way. I can’t do that. My brain’s too quick for that. Then in the next few months, I had four, what I called brushes with death, where I nearly died, or I thought I was going to die. And after the final one, I kind of realized, I've got to learn to meditate. Because I somehow saw that my internal chaos and conflict was somehow attracting more chaos and conflicts in my life as well. I think when I was younger, when I was in my early 20s, I wasn't very aware of very much, I just tended to charge through life. And a big part of that is because of the the bipolar thing that we'll talk about. But it was almost like, it was one of the first times in my life where I just stopped, and thought, what's going on here? And actually created a bit of distance with myself and my circumstances. And I realized to myself, I have to do something different. And so once I'd had that realization, I very quickly flew back to England where I was living, because I was in Spain for my last experience, near death experience, whatever you want to call it. And I flew back to England, and I just booked in for the first meditation course, the first ascension course that I could find. And I went to the course. And I had a really cool time, I really enjoyed the people there. Even though I didn't really understand what they were talking about, you know, I was coming from business, London, New York. And then I was coming to this place where they were talking about peace, and harmony, and love, and flow and all these things and I was like, yeah, that sounds nice. So basically, that's that book.
Eli:
Awesome. And what is it called again?
Oliver:
It's called The Broker Who Broke Free.
Eli:
The Broker Who Broke Free.
Oliver:
And it's on Amazon in Kindle or paperback.
Eli:
So, I don't know if it's your second or third book, I think, Befriending Bipolar.
Oliver:
Yeah.
Eli:
That's the one I guess, kind of the the topic we're talking about today. You want to give a little background on that one and just kind of introduce that one for us, too?
Oliver:
Yeah, sure. So this is Befriending Bipolar. This is a very different book to The Broker Who Broke Free. It's a much thicker book, and it's about my experiences with bipolar disorder. So when I was when I was 17, I started to get more and more manic when I was in my final year of school, and then after school. I started off just getting more and more stressed, and then it got quicker and quicker. And then I started to move into a thing called psychosis, where I started to imagine things were happening in the world that weren't. So for example, I thought that I was being accused of a rape, and that I was going to be arrested and put in prison for the rest of my life. And it was completely real for me. And so everything that would happen in my everyday life would kind of reinforce that fear. You know, the doorbell would ring and I would become paranoid that it was the police coming to arrest me. So even though I hadn't done anything wrong, I hadn't raped anyone,I started to think I had because my mind started to lose it. This got worse and worse, and fairly quickly. I ended up in a mental hospital in Edinburgh for a couple of months. And it was interesting, because the first ward I went to, was a bit like what a lot of people imagine a mental ward is like. A horrifying place with very, very scary people. Screams and security guards having to restrain people, all that kind of stuff. But I was very lucky because my mom insisted that I couldn't stay there, because I mean, I was only 17. And I was very small for my age, I hadn't even fully grown. And it would have it would have really messed me up if I stayed there. But luckily, they moved me to another ward, which was a much more gentle place. They gave me this medication called haloperidol, which was very effective in bringing me down, but it brought me way down.
Eli:
Too down.
Oliver:
Yeah. Because I think as most people know, whenever we take medication, it's kind of an experiment. It's about finding a balance.
Eli:
What works for one person doesn't necessarily work for everybody.
Oliver:
Absolutely. So I went into a drug introduced depression, which is definitely the worst experience I've ever had in my life. Long story short, I spent probably another year and a half, trying to find some kind of balance in my life with medication, without medication. I went to university and started trying to get myself back and find myself again. And after that, I was put on a drug called lithium. Lithium, for most people is like a long term drug. So I was told, when you start this, you may never be able to finish it, you may always be on it.
Eli:
Wow.
Oliver:
Yeah, it's pretty hardcore when you're, I think I was 19 at the time. It's quite a dilemma to face.
Eli:
You're still staring down the rest of your life.
Oliver:
Yeah, absolutely. Fortunately, because of the way I am, and the way I was then, I didn't really give it a lot of thought, I just thought, I've got to try and get well. So I went on lithium, and it worked really well. I didn't have any of those crazy highs for about 10 years, and I didn't have any of the lows either, which is cool. But what I did experience was that I still got this thing called hypomania, which is a high, but it's not as high as mania. So it's more like a situation where I would still talk quite quickly, and I would have a lot of energy and be just chasing girls, I'd be chasing adventure.I would just be very intense person. But it wasn't so bad that it ever got out of hand, so no one really noticed this. Everyone just thought this is my personality, this is me, including me. Then after about 10 years, the side effects of the medication started to catch up on me. And I started to get very tired, and I started to get headaches. And I actually had a lot of problems concentrating as soon as I went on lithium,but it got worse and worse and worse. At the end of 10 years, I started getting more and more side effects. And the people I spoke to, the the alternative health people, homeopaths and supplement people, and lots of different people, they they started telling me, you know, lithium is pretty toxic. And if you don't get off it, your lifespan is going to be reduced, and all these things. And so I thought, I've got to do this, I got to give this a go. So I started off reducing it with the help of a psychiatrist, but very quickly, I kind of fell out with the psychiatrist. I didn't like her. And rather than find another one, I just continued with the help of alternative healers, or a person here or there or whatever, which with hindsight was really foolish, but at the time, it was just the way it was going. Life was kind of unfolding, and I was just going with it. So I had two and a half years of reducing the lithium very, very slowly, and then I went into a massive psychosis where I lived in other dimensions and was completely gone. And then finally, after about four and a half years, I woke up one morning in a mental hospital, and I just knew, I have to go back on lithium, I have to take the side effects. And I went back on lithium and luckily we found a lower dose that I could still be well with. So the side effects aren't nearly as bad as they were.
Eli:
Kind of describe, what is bipolar disorder? Speaking to someone who who doesn't know very much about it like myself, how would you describe it?
Oliver:
As far as I understand it, there are two types of bipolar. Two main types. There's bipolar one, and bipolar two. And bipolar one is is described as a state where you experience a serious depression or many serious depressions that require some kind of hospitalization. And you would also experience manias, and sometimes you would experience both at once,like a manic depression, as it used to be called. So that's bipolar one, and obviously there are people with bipolar one who have long periods when they're well, they're okay. Apparently, if it's not treated, then over time it can cause damage in the brain. So it's very, very important for people to get treatment to try to control it. At the moment, it is not regarded as an illness that can be cured. So it's a lifelong illness. Now of course that could change. As far as I'm concerned, I have, like the title of my book, I feel that I have befriended bipolar, but I haven't overcome it or beaten it or anything like that. It's more like I work with it. Then you have the second type, which is bipolar type two, which is similar, but you haven't necessarily needed hospitalization. But you would still live with depressions that come and go and often manias that come and go. I don't think that people with bipolar two tend to have psychosis. It may be that some do, but most have to just live with an awful lot mood swings that they find hard to control.
Eli:
We have this high and we have this low. Where is healthy? Is that here? Somewhere in the middle?
Oliver:
I think for me healthy is, mentally healthy, is being at peace. It's being in a state where I'm happy, I'm alive, I'm okay with what's going on. I could still feel sad, I could still feel jealous or upset. But those emotions don't completely take me and ruin my life. So I guess it's about having a bit of balance inside here.
Eli:
Like you're feeling the emotions in the proper amounts.
Oliver:
Yeah. Very well said.
Eli:
You talked about your family kind of bearing with you through it. What was the effect that this had on on your life, and your family’s? And the circumstances around you?
Oliver:
Well, I think I should probably split that into the effect it had on my parents and the effect it had on my wife and stepson. My mum, I think it was when I first became ill, it was really difficult for her, because her mother had committed suicide with bipolar. So she was facing her child in the same situation, being ill with this horrible illness. So I think initially, it was extremely hard for her. But I also think that she had to just get on with it and try and help me and try and get me into the right hospital and sort things out. And I think initially, for my dad, he didn't really absorb what was going on. He was he was there in the background offering support, and he came to visit me every day in hospital, as did my mom. And that was brilliant. And he was very caring and loving. But, like I say, he's always been the type to not let things affect him too much. But from my perspective, in a good way, not in a kind of shut down way, more like, here's a situation, let's deal with it. More practical, which was really helpful.
Eli:
If you or someone you know is experiencing a crisis, please call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1-800-273-8255 or visit suicidepreventionlifeline.org for support via live chat. If you or someone you know is in immediate danger, please call 911. Other resources are linked in the show notes.
Oliver:
I didn't realize just how good it is to talk about things. And particularly to talk about things from a space where there's a little bit of distance. So we can see the other person's point of view, and I'm not too emotionally sensitive. I'm able to hear what they have to say without being hurt or freak out or whatever. But just to have a more adult conversation. To let the emotions be there but not to try and blame anyone. I think that's so important, to try to keep blame out of these discussions in these situations. Because when I look at life, I don't see people to blame. I do see everyone I know doing the best they can with what they have learned and how they see the world. And that even goes for people who are doing bad things. When you actually speak to them, you discover that they are doing their best. And that doesn't mean that they should be allowed to do bad things, that's not what I'm saying. But what I am saying is that, if we enter life from a perspective of, that was wrong, this person is evil, if we start to demonize anything, no matter how justified that might seem, then we create an enemy. And nothing good comes from that. And so moving on to my wife and my stepson, I think it was really hard for them when I was ill. Because this reasonably stable influence in the family had disappeared. And my stepson also, obviously this stable figure in his life was not stable, and was scary. It's scary for anyone actually, to see mentally ill people unless they've been working with them. And so that was tough for him. And also the amount of attention that I needed, that he should have been getting as the youngster in the family. There were periods where it was all about me. And I think that was hard for him too. So having said that, there's an awful lot of love that's been created in the family as well because of it. Because we've all had to be a lot more honest with each other than maybe we would have been. And we’ve all had to be a lot more vulnerable. I've particularly had to really learn to listen to other people and absorb how they see things. So there have been silver linings, there have been good things that have come from it.
Eli:
Looking back on it now, are you happy with how it went? Are you happy with how it reshaped and changed your trajectory?
Oliver:
That's a really good question. I feel that, through the spiritual path that I've been on, that I’ve found a lot of peace and happiness and contentment. And mind is very quiet compared to what it used to be like. So I'm a naturally happy, alive person, and I'm really grateful for that. If I don't take my medication, that disappears.
Eli:
Just like that?
Oliver:
Yeah, within a couple of days, two or three days, probably. So I'm one of these people where I'm in the situation where I have to take quite a tough medication. But I'm genuinely happy. So I think what bipolar has forced me to do is, it's forced me to discover a form of happiness that doesn't rely on me getting what I want. So the things in my life that I really enjoy now are things like my relationship with my wife, and my parents, and my friends, and my stepson. Those are really important to me, and they're really nourishing. They're not exciting, travel-the-world relationships, but there's a lot of love there. And things like watching rugby, on the television or going to a match, I just I love it. And before it's I watch a bit of rugby, it's fun, you know, but now it's like, I'm able to really suck the enjoyment out of a simple life.
Eli:
How has having bipolar disorder helped you become an advocate for others struggling, either with that, or just maybe struggling to find peace and happiness?
Oliver:
Well, I've always enjoyed helping people. It's always made me feel good. And over the years, I've learned that helping people is one of the best things that anyone can do for their happiness, and their mental stability. Helping people is, I mean, we should be taught it as a subject at school. It's such a good thing to do. And it's such a natural thing to do. When you look at young children, they so enjoy helping. And they're so willing to be nice to each other if they get the chance.They realize that someone's fallen over and needs comforting, they rush up there with a big smile, and they help them. And so for me, helping has always been really, really important. And when I became an Shire monk, that became more important to me, because I'd actually kind of aligned with a tradition that was about helping, it was about serving. So I don't know how much help I would have been when I was right in the middle of everything, and fighting bipolar and denying it, and just having a lot of issues with it. But once I emerged from that, I thought, gosh, I can actually help people. Because I think that love is something that's massively underrated in the mainstream world. We tend to keep love, like romantic love, there’squite a few movies about that, and then we have family love or love of your football team, or brotherhood, or whatever.
Eli:
Romantic, and then like your group love type of deal.
Oliver:
There are certain situations that we have in our life that feel anything but loving. For example, it could be a job you don't like, or it could be part of your job that you don't like, or it could be a family member that just rubs you the wrong way, or someone that you know you hang out with, but you’d never say you love them. But the interesting thing is that as a human being, to try and force ourselves to love someone is a waste of time. Totally counterintuitive. But to have the intention to show kindness is a form of love. To that person or that situation, it starts to change it and it starts to create love, even if we don't feel loving. Most of us we are trained to think well, I will love once that person shows me. If they show me that they love me, then I’ll love them.But it's actually the other way around. To really love someone, you have to risk not being loved back. So you have to risk showing love, and they don't like it, or they get put off, or they disappear, or they still think you're an idiot. So that's just a bit of a digression, but if you want to you can explore that. It's really fun. So anyway, I just saw that having more love in mental health would make a big difference.
Eli:
How can people like you and me, just everyday normal people, help others who are struggling with similar things?
Oliver:
The first is that, if someone is seriously mentally ill, if they're really struggling or if they're thinking about suicide or death a lot, to encourage them to go to a doctor. That's the first place as far as I'm concerned, trying to get them to, or encourage them to go into the medical system. And then once someone's got professionals around them, I would say, it's important to realize that it's the illness that is expressing, not them all the time. So if they are mean, or if they don't want to see you, or if they say hurtful things, realize it's an illness speaking. It’s not them. And then, when they are in a place where you can talk, probably the best thing to do is to ask them how you can help them. What is it that they need? Do they want to just know you're in the background and they can text you whenever they want? Or do they want to be visited in hospitals? Or do they need help with using the computer because they're feeling a bit confused at the moment?
Eli:
Well, Oliver, thank you so much for coming on and doing this. For sharing your story and providing some education about what bipolar is and also how to help with it. I can see, I know it's your mission to spread peace and happiness, and you already did that for me, so there's another person you can add to the list. Thank you so much.
Oliver:
Well, thank you. You've been a fantastic interviewer. You're staying on it and sensitive to what's going on and you ask really good questions.
Eli:
Thank you.
Oliver:
I feel very relaxed talking to you. So thanks very much.
Eli:
This is Unsilent. Thank you for listening. Today's episode was hosted and produced by me, Eli Lawson, Lance Bordelon, John Panicucci, and the rest of the incredible NoStigmas marketing team. Special thanks to Oliver for sharing his story this week and being so courageous and open. You can find a link to his work in the show notes. To go beyond the show, connect with us on social media or visit nostigmas.org to learn more about mental health topics. Please leave us a five star review and share with others wherever you listen to podcasts. We’d really appreciate it. New episodes of Unsilent come out every Wednesday at 2:00pm Eastern time. And finally, remember that, whatever you're going through, you don't have to do it alone. Be Unsilent. We’ll see you next week.